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home : opinion : letters May 24, 2016


2/18/2014 6:00:00 AM
Letter: All about control

In response to Denise Bensusan's Sunday commentary, she seems to be extremely short on facts. The Democratic Party is all about control: controlling issues and money, but mostly people. They have learned the more freebies you give someone you tend to control their vote, and the vote and power is what it is all about. They could care less about the minorities' struggle to find jobs, support their families or making ends meet just so long as they vote their way.

It was the Republicans who fought for years to abolish slavery while the Democrats fought to keep the blacks enslaved, as they owned large plantations and the slaves who worked those plantations.

While both parties are responsible for shafting their constituents, the Democratic Party by far is the worst.

As far as the churches go, you really should do your homework, Denise. During the wars and the Great Depression, including the one we are in now, it is the churches that help out as many people as they can and do it without taxpayers' money.

Sam Wise

Kingman


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Reader Comments

Posted: Wednesday, March 12, 2014
Article comment by: DENISE BENSUSAN

You (so called) Facts are scewed! You had better dig way deeper than this........

Posted: Sunday, March 9, 2014
Article comment by: Non-fearing Catholic

Hilarious - thanks for the laughs. Discussion ends with Catholics drinking from one CHALICE. Yes, check your speller. Your remarks are as disposable as your little communion cups. Oh, and where is your faith? If you had enough you could handle poisonous snakes or even drink poison. I have faith I am drinking the Blood of Christ and feel confident I will not get sick. Or is it that we Catholics drink real wine (alcohol) not grape juice. I know, so liberal, but yet so fundamentalist when taking communion. Who can explain it? By the way, did Jesus have little plastic throwaways at the last supper.
Finally, rock on Denise.


Posted: Tuesday, March 4, 2014
Article comment by: Frank Lee Speaking

"Cults would be something like........"

..........The Saucer Cult of Erich von Daniken? You know, the convicted felon who had to admit in court that he faked his evidence for ancient Italians?

You never miss a chance to denigrate Christians for their beliefs, yet the above named scam artist is your main source for your saucer gods belief.

You're comedy gold.

LOL


Posted: Monday, March 3, 2014
Article comment by: Amaryllis Smith

Lori, I'm with you as for drinking out of the Challace as everyone else. I've never drank anything after another including my husband, children and grandchildren. But, the Catholis doing so didn't create HIV although I agree the spread of colds, flu and other germs most certainly must happen.
Thank goodness other churches use the individual throw away plastic vials!


Posted: Sunday, March 2, 2014
Article comment by: Lori Gabriel-Dane

Say What???

So you have it on whose word that a certain disease didn't start at a Catholic church? You can say with absolute certainty that no such thing could happen? Can anyone exactly pin point exactly where they picked up germs, the flu, a cold, or anything else? All I'm saying is that I was appalled when I saw all these people sipping from the same challace. One priest placed the wafers in people's mouths, and the other priest offered the challace for them to sip from. Are people that trusting that they think no one would dare enter a house of God if they had some contageous disease? All I can say is that you couldn't have paid me to drink from that challace.

Now, would one of you Catholics on here please answer my question - is this normal procedure in the Catholic church, or was this just happening at this one particular church?


Posted: Sunday, March 2, 2014
Article comment by: Life Explained? It's About Beliefs!

I wrote the previous article, not to berate, but rather inspire thought. Not to discharge anyone’s beliefs but to show that there are other logical and believable reasons of how we came into existence. Additionally, why is the bible the way it is, why were so many “other” stories or “parts” of this bible, intentionally left out. It’s very easy to throw up barriers as we have to this day, each religion believing only their “bible” or “book” is the one and only truth. Think about it, if we came from elsewhere, and there are “visitors”, doesn’t it make sense they would avoid us. We can’t even live with each other in harmony and mainly for religious reasons. I don’t think I would want to visit a “World” rout with war and hatred in fear of my own life, no thank you, I’ll watch from a distance and call me when you settle your differences.

Posted: Sunday, March 2, 2014
Article comment by: Life Explained? It's About Beliefs!

I’m not dissing those who believe in the bible. The bible is a great “made for television” dialog. I like watching great movies just as much as I enjoy a good documentary. I am a man of facts, so I’m more inclined to believe documentaries that depict reasonable thought and common sense. Now I don’t believe we came from some Goo or are descendants of apes, however, I also don’t believe we were created by a wave of a hand over. There is viable proof, of an existence of man, carved in stone that clearly shows a higher intelligence existed prior to the 6,000 year old bible, makes you wonder. Were they one of many “foreign” or “alien” beings that visited, to help move us along in the evolution of life? It’s not completely unbelievable nor would it be the first time, which these beings would play the “God” card on a less sophisticated and less educated population. Isn’t it believable that this population would classify someone who has an exhibits behaviors, technology, or knowledge as a “God?” I’m not going to deny or berate those who believe, but again, I’m a man of facts and until someone can convince me that there is a “God”, and that he doodled carvings in stone, of what he was going to create, then I will stick to my beliefs that we are not alone.

Posted: Friday, February 28, 2014
Article comment by: Say What?????/

I guess that explains all the massive outbreaks of communicable diseases we hear about in the news that originate in the Catholic church.
Oh yea, that's right, I've never heard of any.


Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2014
Article comment by: Lori Gabriel-Dane

Linda,
Christ, Evangelical and Reformed, the Litheran church I attended when I was young was not a cult. Cults would be something like Jonestown, or the one in Waco, TX. Brainwashed people believing a religious nut job - that's a cult.

Linda, I have no desire to attend any church, nor the desire to believe that there is a God, but if, and I say if, I ever decide to believe there is such a thing as God, I don't need a church to go to. I could pray to him all by myself, and it won't cost me a dime.

I was a caregiver for an elderly couple about ten years ago. They were Catholic, and every morning I drove them to church so they could take Holy Communion. I was shocked to see people lined up to sip off the SAME CHALLACE. The priest had a little hand towel that he would swipe across the lip of the cup before the next person drank from it. I could not believe my eyes. And you wonder how pandemics start? Is this normal practice in the Catholic church? At the church I went to, we had little individual vials of grape juice that were passed out to people to sip from. Do Catholics have that much faith in God to believe that all the people sipping off the cup before him didn't have some highly contageous disease, STD, or aids? If so, they really are pressing their luck!


Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2014
Article comment by: Amaryllis Smith

My X was raised Morman, when we got to transfer from his duty station at Houck and come back to Kingman we did get a bill from that church which I said was BS. He hadn't attended the church since he graduated high school here in 1961 and it was '72 when we transf. back.
However, there was a Morman church at Sanders 7mi. west. two couples of that church were brothers Ted and Pat Spurlock. They owned a large ranch at Navajo 21mi. west.
In Feb. 1971 when DPS Officer's Jim Keeton and Don Beckstead were killed less than 1/2 mile west of Houck on I-40, Ted and Verna Spurlock came and took our 25mo. old and 12mo. old and them along with another officers' two little ones for over a week.
That period of time was I believe one of two biggest traumas in my life. Not only did Beckstead & wife Betty live next to us at Houck with two young boys, My X got the first call leaving with his , t-shirt, tennis shoes & socks on along with his ID & gunbelt. He found Beckstead with a 357mag wound to the abdomen still alive and had crawled back to his patrol veh., Ben drove him to the Hospital in Gallup N.M. in that veh..
Had not been for the absolute loving help and care we received from the Spurlocks' and Mr. and Mrs. Follette station owners at Houck I don't know how we would have managed! Love 'em!


Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2014
Article comment by: Linda Athens - Proud Straight Christian

Lori:

You obviously were in the wrong church. What church was it? Perhaps it was a cult. There are many of them out there, pretending to be Christian. I have left numerous churches as I have moved around, realizing it wasn't the right one for me.

Some get into doctrines I don't agree with as one did and after explaining why I felt it was wrong and noone listened, I prayed for them and moved on.

All science comes from God Lori. After all, He created the whole ball of wax so of course, science was created by Him also.

Please give another church a chance, We aren't getting any younger and you have been ill. Just ask God if He's there. He wants to pour His love out on you. Ask Him if He has a church for you to try.

Incidentally, I am not Christian because I want to go to Heaven. I could care less about an after life. My husband always said he would run me thru a blender and feed my iris. That would work for me. I am a Christian because I know Jesus is who He says He is. He is so provable it is hard to understand how anyone misses it.


Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2014
Article comment by: Lori Gabriel-Dane

Linda,

You never got a bill from a church? Well, lucky you!

OKR,

I did not voluntarily "join" that church. It was the church my parents forced me to go to when I was still young and living at home. I was Baptised, Confirmed and married in that church. All my children were baptised in that church as well, only because it was the only church I had ever known. I "forced" my children to attend Sunday school, and they hated it. Once they were old enough to think for themselves, I left the choice of whether to attend church or not up to them. They all quit going. And, after I received that bill, I quit going, as well.

Religion is fine if you believe everything the church tells you and you honestly believe that someday you're going to go to heaven, but for those of us who see life differently than religious people, it serves no earthly use, other than to make us trust scientists more.

You don't think religion is used to make money? look at all the big-name TV Evangelists with their huge and extravagant churches and the 10s-of-thousands who give their hard-earned money to these jokers so they can live in mansions. For a certain amount of money, they'll pray for you. Hey, you don't have to pay to pray. And you certainly don't need a middle-man to do it for you.


Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2014
Article comment by: Linda Athens

Lori:

Our federal income tax is to run the country but it's not enough - that's why we have to borrow from other countries?

Really? Is that how you run your household? Never plan ahead, HAVE NO BUDGET, overspend, then wonder why you don't have enough?

That is the real reason we borrow. Waste and fraud alone is disgraceful. How long since we have even had a budget? Your thoughts on obama putting us into trillions more debt because in your diatribe against Reagan, one of the best President's in our history, you forgot to mention obama's debt that is burying us.

A bill from the church? I have been attending church for some 65 years and have yet to ever get a bill from a church.


Posted: Tuesday, February 25, 2014
Article comment by: Another Thought

"They cannot read things such as "No Trespassing, No Soliciting, and Private Property"."

I would think after you slam the door on them a few times and see there is no welcome mat at the driveway that they would get a clue.


Posted: Tuesday, February 25, 2014
Article comment by: V Stokes

Well, it may have just been an implied commitment in the case of LGD...but I've had a different experience.

My Ex converted and joined a church (I guess temple is the correct term). She was required to pay almost $1500 each year to the building fund. Either spaced out or in a single payment. If she didn't, she was no longer "in good standing" and was not allowed to attend services or events. This was not made known to her until after the initial process. Being a smart woman, she decided that it was basically extortion and left.


Posted: Tuesday, February 25, 2014
Article comment by: Lori Gabriel-Dane

OKR:

In case you forgot, the only ones to prosper during Reagan's presidency were the wealthy. The economy was so bad, crime rose, and financial sector went to work with their illegal scams, just as they were allowed to get away with during the W. Bush presidency (remember Exxon scandal). Reagan's "trickle down" policy was a failure. There was a recession, major unemployment, and a large deficit handed over to H.W. Bush. (yeah, there was another president in charge between Reagan and Clinton.) Clinton inherited a budget deficit form George H. W. Bush. Clinton's "trickle up" policies worked, and he managed to leave a surplus for George W. Bush, which Bush managed to go through quicky and turn it into a huge deficit and two wars. Bush's spending and policies led to major unemployment, the housing market scams, and the financial district's illegal scams, just like what happened under Reagan. What, you think after so many years people forget what life was like under Reagan? Not hardly. The wealthy loved Reagan and W. Bush. The rest of us suffered under them.


Posted: Monday, February 24, 2014
Article comment by: Anson's Nephew

"The surplus during Clinton' s first term was the legacy from the Regan years."

Who's "Regan?"

".It was quickly gone."

Yes, The Criminal saw to that in short order.




Posted: Monday, February 24, 2014
Article comment by: Origional Kingman Resident

"Receiving a bill from the church is not my idea of a "voluntary" donation."

You voluntarily joined the church. You voluntarily made your pledge. The bill the church sent was a reminder to pay, there was no legal contract that they could use to enforce your payments.

Got to love you libs, you make outlandish statements and then back pedal on the words you chose to use when you are called on them.

By the way, the taxes we pay and the money we borrow, (which are future tax liabilities), are not solely to support "this country we love". We send billions to other countries. Not only that but it is not the federal government's job to "support the country". The government only has 1 job, to protect our borders, (which it refuses to do).

The surplus during Clinton' s first term was the legacy from the Regan years. It was quickly gone. Financial improvements durning Clinton's second term was due to the Republican's Contract with America which scaled back government. Clinton had no other option but to go along with since the House and Senate could easily over ride his veto.
Got to love how the libs blame Bush 5 years later for Obama's failures but give Clinton credit for the strong economy left over from Regan.


Posted: Monday, February 24, 2014
Article comment by: anonymous anonymous

Democrat party is all about control? I find this letter amusing, both parties are about control, just each one wants the control, this letter writer must live in a right wing Peyton Place, their beloved republican party wants control and are working hard to regain it every election cycle! Its the nature of the beast!

Posted: Sunday, February 23, 2014
Article comment by: pl .....

@Bob Moore, "no taxes". Yup, that's the bone which our Government throws to the faithful dogs whose sermons, spread out over a lifetime, will carry nary a reference to those wars-based-upon-packs-of-lies, the criminal rape of our privacies and other rights, etc.

Posted: Sunday, February 23, 2014
Article comment by: Lori Gabriel-Dane

it's all free, anyway....

I understand that the put in those envelopes are meant to support the church, repairs, the pastor, etc. What I was disputing is OKR and Linda's comments about donations being "voluntary."
Receiving a bill from the church is not my idea of a "voluntary" donation.

The same goes for Federal Income Tax. That money goes to help support this country. Although it is not enough to run an entire country, that is the reason we must borrow money from other countries. If you remember correctly, when Bill Clinton raised taxes, we ended up with a surplus and didn't have to borrow from anyone. And guess what? We had a surplus even though we had unemployment insurance, Social Security, and all the other programs you Republicans keep harping about and want to get rid of.

Granted, Income Tax is not voluntary, but we are contributing to the support of the country we live in and claim to love. If you don't want to help support this country, you'd best move to a country that better suits your bitterness toward helping to keep a country running.


Posted: Sunday, February 23, 2014
Article comment by: Anson's Nephew

“…how on earth do you expect them to pay for…”

Yeah, and all of those taxes too. Oh wait. Never mind.


Posted: Saturday, February 22, 2014
Article comment by: I Think Not!

"we couldn't live up to our pledge and at the end of that year, we were sent a bill for the remainder of the pledge."

I can't figure out how they were able to track anything with the education they have. They cannot read things such as "No Trespassing, No Soliciting, and Private Property".


Posted: Saturday, February 22, 2014
Article comment by: it's all free, anyway .....

I never go to church, but in all fairness Ms. G-D, how on earth do you expect them to pay for parking lots, buildings, insurance, pastors (who need all the same things you need), etc., without expecting monies from those who attend?

Posted: Friday, February 21, 2014
Article comment by: Justa Citizen

LGD,
Being an agnostic and seeing similar situations in my early life, I agree with most all of what you say about the churches when you were growing up and when your husband lost his job, etc.
It still comes down to the fact that the church could not do a thing to you if you didn't donate to them.
The government just takes it and if you don't pay what they tell you that you owe, you can count on them following through with further tactics. In today's world, there's no telling what that might be.
Again, there's a big difference between voluntary donations and confiscated earnings.



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