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home : opinion : letters April 30, 2016


5/7/2014 6:00:00 AM
Letter: Cliven Bundy, freedom-loving rebel

America's founding fathers were not operating from court precedents when they rebelled against tyranny, so why should Cliven Bundy? At the time, law entitled the king's men to enter colonists' homes more or less at will, and to institute taxes without consulting those who would have to pay them. Does that sound even remotely familiar? (Think NSA entry into - and capture of - all your private communications, and then those executive orders signed without the slightest reference to law or representation.)

We'll keep it brief here - never mind the wars based upon lies and profiteering, millions of illegals legitimized without your approval, piratical police behaviors, etc. But in brief, don't try to make a case against Bundy just because an administrative law judge (not a fully qualified judge and jury) ruled against Cliven Bundy a couple times.

Philip Lundquist

Bullhead City



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Reader Comments

Posted: Tuesday, May 27, 2014
Article comment by: Frank Lee Speaking

@MK

"And the OWS has used the donations they received to buy up the debts of others and WRITE THEM OFF."

Really? Odd that you chose not to name whose debt and how mauch they paid off. Did the OWS crowd do this before or after doing drugs, raping women, and crapping on cop cars.

@AN

"With the amazing numbers of Constitutional experts, Constitutional Scholars and Constitutional Lawyers here...."

Now now, be kind. Not everyone has enjoyed the benefit of a affirmative action ivy league education and a questionable appointment as a Constitutional law professor as your president has.

LOL



Posted: Monday, May 26, 2014
Article comment by: Frank Lee Speaking

"With the amazing numbers of Constitutional experts, Constitutional Scholars and Constitutional Lawyers here it would make sense for the highest court in the land be in Kingman,....."

Well, not everyone is the recipient of a affirmative action ivy league college education and a named a Constitutional law instructor based on nothing more than their skin tone......like your president. Think we will ever see his college transcripts?

LOL


Posted: Wednesday, May 21, 2014
Article comment by: az mac

No where does the constitution give the federal government any authority over any of the land. The federal government was only given authority over the seas. No where in the constitution does it give the authority to created the BLM or most of the other departments of the federal government. The constitution is there to limit the federal government. Not listed in the constitution then it belongs to the state and the people.

Posted: Wednesday, May 21, 2014
Article comment by: Cliven, you're not forgotten, and neither is American ingenuity.....

Just wanted to let you all know that I made some preliminary enquiries into production of a Cliven Bundy doll set (this would include militia members, Sheriff Gillespie, and Senator Harry Reid). One possible production facility is China's Leannie Ltd. at $1500 startup costs for each doll figure, which does not include all computer design that they intend to have been completed domestically here, in their proper format and sent by specified means. I was a little put off by their website, intended to impress prospective clients, but which featured in one photo all 1800 company employees - who, it points, live on company premises. Back to work................

Posted: Saturday, May 17, 2014
Article comment by: Anson's Nephew

Bundy timeline…1953, David Bundy applies for grazing permit.

1956, he becomes delinquent on grazing fees.

1983, Cliven Bundy tries to transfer grazing permit but is denied because his dad is delinquent on fees, continues to graze cattle on our land.

1993, Bundy pays a portion of his grazing fees, then stops paying.

1994, BLM goes to federal court. Bundy refuses to recognize the federal government. He owes $25,218.80.

1995, BLM says Bundy owes $90.142.50.

1998, U.S. District court finds Bundy guilty of trespassing and permanently bans him from federal lands.

1999, Bundy loses in appeals court and is fined for willful trespass.

2010, Bundy tells LV paper he “fired” the BLM in 1993. Continues to graze cattle on our land.

2011, BLM demands payment of $292,601.50 from Bundy.

2013, BLM reports it will round up Bundy’s cattle from our land and Bundy threatens federal officials.

2014, BLM begins round-up of cattle, Bundy threatens officials, calls for “militia” help who set up sniper nests on highways and aim high-powered weapons at BLM officers. Bundy demands sheriff destroy federal facilities, confiscate their weapons and give them to him.

Sources – BLM public documents and videos of Bundy and “militia” personnel.





Posted: Friday, May 16, 2014
Article comment by: Funny How the Ones Screaming the Loudest About Welfare are the Queens

No way did he pay a dime. There is no way he send any money to any government agency for his mooching. That is really the issue. It really boils down to money - Clive just doesn't want to pay like other ranchers. Clive is a welfare queen!

Posted: Thursday, May 15, 2014
Article comment by: Another Thought

"They say, Clive Bundy family maintained the use of the land since 1880's. (before "fedral" BLM) Even took any kind of interest in any land of the "west"."

Fact check please. Dates are not correct as to when the Bundy's settled in the area. Just because Bundy said so doesn't make it so, you have to go with provable facts.


Posted: Monday, May 12, 2014
Article comment by: V Stokes

"...he mailed the check for payment." To who? Clark County? That's not who the money was owed to. Do you pay your plumber for what the electrician did?


"...maybe if someone has resided on the land, before the BLM...That they should have more to stand on than the US Govt."

He wasn't "residing" on the land, he was using it to fatten his cattle.

If I went out and turned some of the property outside of town into my own personal motocross track, and the owners told me to stop...could I just continue to use it and ignore any court orders?


Posted: Monday, May 12, 2014
Article comment by: Anson's Nephew


@UNC

“…it is second hand and even lower tiered.”

Curious how you classify actual video supporting the FACTS along with actual court papers further supporting the FACTS you – in your infinite wisdom – have decided that proof is second-hand or “lower-tiered” – whatever that means.

“Maybe your Facts should be stated more like it is my opinion …”

No, the FACTS I presented are fully substantiated as outlined above and are not my opinion.



Posted: Monday, May 12, 2014
Article comment by: April Bach

Ok, first of all take the soap boxes and emotion out of this completely. Read the court documents. They say, Clive Bundy family maintained the use of the land since 1880's. (before "fedral" BLM) Even took any kind of interest in any land of the "west". Second, after the ruling that Bundy would need to pay $1.53 per head of cattle he mailed the check for payment. Third, the Department of Interior was awarded the ability to impound in November of 1993. It is now 2014 and they just now acted on the court order. Wasting tax payer money for numerous court orders to say the same thing. So, not only is the BLM wrong so is Bundy. But, dont you think that maybe just maybe if someone has resided on the land, before the BLM was even interested Bundy family (1880), BLM Dept of Interior (1993) before they even decided anything in regards to Mr. Bundy and the land that he grazes on. That they should have more to stand on than the US Govt. Not only that but the US Government owns 81% of the land in Nevada alone. I dont know if any of you realize this. But, 81% is a whole lot more than what Clive Bundy is fighting for. Look it up yourself, stop listening to whatever the news tells you to and look for yourself and keep some dignity!!

Posted: Sunday, May 11, 2014
Article comment by: Philip L.....

So a bully with an extensive criminal record of orchestrating false arrests, home break-ins, murder, and profiteering through their collusively-produced films is confronted by someone ready to fight and die for principle. The bully cowardly backs off and complains to the media about it, while scheming to later come after the other person unexpectedly at their home or place of work - in overwhelming force and with criminal charges irrespective of the millions he has killed for the dollar, those he has arrested for drug-related offences even while he and his pals have smuggled billions of dollars worth of drugs into the country, and generally earns his income from, and relishes, the deceit and thuggery characterising his profession. OK, then, who do you root for?

Posted: Sunday, May 11, 2014
Article comment by: Uncle Anson

"Since EVERY one of these items can be easily verified I must ask, where are you getting your information? "

Same place you do except I acknowledge, that at best, it is second hand and even lower tiered. That is why I look at it with interest and objectively as not as fact.. For example : opinion...the hare is faster than the turtle. Fact: the turtle beat the hare. Maybe your Facts should be stated more like " it is my opinion that or from what I can gather it appears that" and not as FACT until all of us get the rest of the story. Have a nice day.


Posted: Sunday, May 11, 2014
Article comment by: Uncle Anson

AN- what is it with lefties? You cannot even quote what another says. I said thank you Cliven and followed by stating that no matter the outcome we will be strengthened as a people and a nation. Where did I voice support for him? If he is judged wrong we win, if he is acquitted we win. That's how it works. We verify rules, laws and the Constitution through this process. You are so closed minded to a blind allegiance to some ideology that you have lost the ability for independent thought and logical evaluation of anything but your opinion.


Posted: Sunday, May 11, 2014
Article comment by: Anson's Nephew

“Oh pardon me ....it was you called them dim bulb militia.”

Yes, I did and stand by it.

“FACT- those are not facts.”

So you are claiming the old crook did not refuse to pay his grazing fees for more than 20 years –did not claim “ancestral rights” to public (i.e. our) land –did not go to court multiple times – did not lose every single court case – did not state he doesn’t believe in our government – did not demand the sheriff follow his orders to destroy federal property, disarm federal officers and turn their weapons over to him – did not welcome “militia” to take up arms against federal officers and did not say “Negroes” would be better off on plantations.

Since EVERY one of these items can be easily verified I must ask, where are you getting your information?

And please, I don’t need nor accept your “love.” Kinda creeps me out.


Posted: Sunday, May 11, 2014
Article comment by: pl .....

Throughout the Bundy affair, I daily re-evaluated the situation as facts became apparent. That said, salient points have remained throughout - including my own life experience of government abuses, and questions regarding Bundy's 52 rancher neighbours who lost their businesses. I agree with Fox Hound, that my comments have been too brief, given the ramifications of this case. It would do injustice to the crimes which this government has committed to attempt their discussion within the Miner's word limit. But in that context, a case for some of Bundy's views can be made.

Posted: Sunday, May 11, 2014
Article comment by: Marla Kiriakidis

So Bundy is a "real" American. Fighting for the "little guy". But the people that protest wall street are lazy, dirty bums. Wow. And here I thought cheating and stealing were wrong. But I guess its only wrong if your poor. This man isn't some poor rancher. When the police started arresting the OWS protesters many of you cheered. Bundy's supporters are pointing guns at more than just BLM agents. At least the OWS people didn't want to start a civil war, they just wanted someone to answer for the financial mess the bankers made. And the OWS has used the donations they received to buy up the debts of others and WRITE THEM OFF. All this guy has done is to try and divide our country.

Posted: Saturday, May 10, 2014
Article comment by: David Gaither

[quote] "The Constitution was crafted so that it would be understood by those governed under it."

EXACTLY, UA! This is what the "bent-left" continuously try to get Americans to forget. It's always that only they know the Constitution.

Actually, I did take an online course, from Hillsdale College, so I do feel qualified to offer my "opinion", occasionally, on Constitutional matters. After all, isn't it "opinions" that the SCOTUS offers on all it's matters??


Posted: Saturday, May 10, 2014
Article comment by: Anson's Nephew

@UNC

“Seems to me that one saying others aren't implies that they are?”

I did not imply they are not, I implied exactly the opposite. It is more than obvious from the comments that appear here there are many, many constitutional scholars and experts in Kingman. My only question was why the Supreme Court is not based in a community with such an amazing wealth of knowledge to assist them in their decision making procedures.

“2014.....thank you Cliven.”

What is it with you supporting a bigoted old crook who stole more than a million dollars from the American taxpayers over a twenty year period? I thought so-called “conservatives were adamant about not tolerating crooks.

”You see how it works now?”


Posted: Saturday, May 10, 2014
Article comment by: Uncle Anson

"I have to wonder why the Supreme Court of the United States is not based in Kingman. With the amazing numbers of Constitutional experts.........it would make sense for the highest court in the land be in Kingman......"

Now who claims to be the expert? Seems to me that one saying others aren't implies that they are?

The Constitution was crafted so that it would be understood by those governed under it. It is pretty simple when read for what it says and not for what the reader wants it to say. Personal agendas and special interest groups, including political parties and those governing have turned it into a toy for their pleasure and advantage. Sooner or later, those governed become disinterested or convinced that there is little if any power they have to even be heard. How sad that we have to be reminded.

1776.....thank you gentlemen. The outcome wasn't perfect but what a start.

1776-2014.....thank you Women's Suffrage, Rosa Parks, our Soldiers and those driving our Constitutional Amendments.

2014.....thank you Cliven. Regardless of the outcome we will be strengthened as a people and as a nation.

You see how it works now?


Posted: Saturday, May 10, 2014
Article comment by: doug heard

"....and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States..."

Which applies to the things enumerated in Article 1 section 8 as per James Madison who wrote it.


Posted: Saturday, May 10, 2014
Article comment by: Our Local Expertise

"I have to wonder why the Supreme Court of the United States is not based in Kingman."

Good point. But it's got to be only a matter of time before our local constitutional expertise is discovered. All it would take would be for the Supreme Court justices to read the comment sections of the Miner to realize that all their years of legal training were wasted and that they should instead be consulting our local experts for opinions. Then SCOTUS could just eliminate the entire federal government and we could all live happily ever after in paradisical anarchy.


Posted: Saturday, May 10, 2014
Article comment by: V Stokes

@ DH

"....and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States..."

So...you don't think SS, roads, deposit insurance, VA hospitals, or interstate law enforcement, National parks, (etc, etc) contribute to the general welfare of the US? Got it.


Posted: Saturday, May 10, 2014
Article comment by: Anson's Nephew

“You are right and all of those are not constitutional.”

I have to wonder why the Supreme Court of the United States is not based in Kingman. With the amazing numbers of Constitutional experts, Constitutional Scholars and Constitutional Lawyers here it would make sense for the highest court in the land be in Kingman, close to the seat of all of that Constitutional expertise and knowledge


Posted: Friday, May 9, 2014
Article comment by: doug heard

("I can't find BLM anywhere in the Constitution."

You're right, neither is the FDIC, DOT, or SSA (or any number of Federal agencies like the VA or FBI).)

You are right and all of those are not constitutional. If it's not listed in Article 1 Section 8 then the Federal government is forbidden to create them. See Amendments 9 and 10. Not enumerated then the Feds can't do it.


Posted: Friday, May 9, 2014
Article comment by: Same Bunch Same Nonsense

"he decided he no longer recognized the government of our nation, called in a bunch of dim-bulb militia"
Oh pardon me ....it was you called them dim bulb militia.

FACT- those are not facts. They are simply left wing perception spins as viewed from the left.

Yep continued use of insults. Yep justified.

By your own admission "righties" populate these pages. Looks to me like left is the minority and this is a government of the people. Gee guess what?

I reckon we support "goofy old bigots" ( a bigot of race is only one kind of bigot) but we love ya none the less AN.



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