The myth of Clinton winning the popular vote

I have already grown weary of the sore loser liberals claiming Hillary won the popular vote, therefore she really won the election. Let's hit the truth button here.

First, had it been the other way around, they would be extolling the virtues of the Electoral College.

Second, Donald Trump followed the rules. You don't get to change the rules after the fact to make your candidate a winner. Hillary lost, fair and square.

Listen up, sore losers. Here's how it works. Donald Trump campaigned to win the Electoral college because that is how the election laws work. Had the winner been decided by the popular vote, he would have campaigned more in California/New York type states, filled with liberals. He won the election by following the rules.

On to voter fraud, an area the Democrats rule in. Examples, the dead regularly vote in Chicago. California gave driver's licenses to illegals last Spring 2016 while Obama explained to illegals it was safe for them to vote in the election.

Studies of the 2008 and 2010 elections show significant numbers of illegals did vote. Possibly taking the illegal votes out of both California and New York in this 2016 election, Hillary just might not have had the big popular vote victories there she thinks she had. . We don't know but we do know a lot of illegals voted and no doubt they voted for Hillary. God knows, her and Obama worked hard enough to get the illegal vote. Too bad she didn't work that hard to get the electoral votes. Trump did.

Then there are the uncounted votes in some states where if the number of uncounted ballots is less than the victory margin, they don't count those ballots. That means, we don't know what the actual popular vote totals were. Most tend to be absentee ballots which usually favor Republicans . Again, had all been counted, Trump could have won the popular vote.

Also what must be factored in is voter suppression done by the liberals. Case in point. California had no Republican candidate for Senate due to a passed initiative that had the two highest vote getters in an open primary facing off in the general. Republicans were actually denied a candidate on the ballot. Since most Republicans figured California would go to Hillary in the POTUS race and they had no Senate candidate to even vote for, many just stayed home. Had they voted, Trump would undoubtedly have had many more votes which also could have changed Hillary's lead in the popular vote.

Anyway you cut it, we don't really know what the actual popular vote showed legally.

What we do know is that out of 3141 counties, Trump won 3084 and Hillary only won 57. That means Trump won the popular vote in 3084 counties and Hillary only won the popular vote in 57 counties. Trump trounced her big time. Do you libs get it now. If Hillary were declared winner of the popular vote, she would only have won the popular vote in 57 out of 3141 counties. Perhaps you can understand the Electoral College a little better now, accept Trump's big win following the election laws we live under and stop your disruptions and whining.

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Smith 1 month ago

Myth? I find that funny coming from a person who thinks Obama is a illegal alien, Kenyan smuggled into the USA for a 50 year old conspiracy to install a secret Muslim into the white house, who is a terrorist and was tutored by a black racist Christian preacher for what purpose only they can fathom! Facts one cannot deny, Clinton won the popular vote, Trump won electoral college vote, one can debate did he have Russian help, is he a Russian puppet on Putin's strings for $900+ million in loans and is going to do the bidding of a foreign dictator, only time will tell the last one, but election is over the votes have been counted!!! Dec. 19, the electoral college votes end of story!!

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Wildrose 1 month ago

This post is typical of a Hillary Clinton voter. Pathetic but enough said. It speaks for itself.

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Trakker 4 weeks, 1 day ago

And Linda your myth of a savior will soon be revealed. With the GOP eating into your Social Security check! You will soon see the result, no excuses, no blaming Obama or any other party. Vote a crazy, bigoted, person into office... you own it. It can only go downhill from here, mark my words. Your sources have been debunked so many times. Scream, and write all the articles you want... but until you get away from those extreme right wing sources you're a lost cause. My only hope is that people will "stop" responding to your propaganda! You've obviously convinced yourself, but then again, you did the same with Romney who says he's bad news! You remember now?

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Smith 4 weeks, 1 day ago

Is not democracy wonderful, I get to vote for whom I wish and you as well and your opinion means nothing to me, and obviously mine angers you! I truly do not care what you think!!! Now run along and pretend you control more than one vote on election day and that one key board in front of you!

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TBD1000 4 weeks, 1 day ago

Such bile from the religious conscience of Kingman---what part of "got more votes than Trump" don't you understand? Definition of "winning the popular vote". All the rest is the typical basket of illogic usually spewed here. Next we'll hear about the millions of illegal votes no one can seem to find.

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alkoffman 1 month ago

Yes, Trump won and is now the President elect. You Linda are the one who doesn't seem to get over it, just want to keep on ragging about Hillary. And no Linda, contrary to your belief, I am not a Democrat, never have been and I did not vote for Trump. But I'm willing to give him a chance which is more that you and those like you were willing to do for Obama.

But one thing is consistent about you in all the years you have written and commented, and that is you never let facts get in your way. Actually, I think that may be a compliment as the Republicans have now caught up to you.

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MohaveFree 1 month ago

Amazing! this dude claims that Linda Athens "keep(s) on ragging about Hillary." Yet other than mentioning that "HilLIARy" only won a precious few counties, she doesn't say a word about the narcissistic, pathological, greedy, law-breaking Democrat candidate.

I strongly suspect that alkoffman is a liberal Democrat (an endangered species in Mohave County), who simply hates anyone that dares to tell the truth about his "heroes." He ridiculously claims that Linda doesn't let the facts get in the way, while ignoring verifiable details and facts in her column! As a Republican, I can say, we confidently endorse Linda's words while stating that we've "caught up to you."

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InformedIndependent 1 month ago

Actually Linda, it has been said before, and will say it again now, you need to stop believing those emails and memes you keep seeing. The counties story has already been debunked as fake news. Really, you need to get out more.

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Wildrose 4 weeks, 1 day ago

I don't use e-mail and just got back from two trips to Houston and San Antonio. I am ready to stay home for awhile but thanks anyway.

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InformedIndependent 4 weeks, 1 day ago

You need to try and sell that fabrication somewhere else. You quote the falsely on almost a daily basis. So, that makes it about as factual as you voting for Kennedy in 1960.

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BBB 1 month ago

There are in fact NO significant "Studies of the 2008 and 2010 elections show significant numbers of illegals did vote." which is why this author cited no sources. We do know that there was hacking (by republican sympathizers).

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Wildrose 4 weeks, 1 day ago

Will try again on this one. One study shows over 14% of non-citizens are registered to vote with 6.4% actually voting in the 2008 election.
The Cooperative Congressional Election Study (CCES) came to this finding via large samplings during the 2008 and 2010 elections of non-citizens ( illegal immigrants, legals but on their way to citizenship so can't vote yet legally and lawful permanent residents without citizenship). Any of those voting committed a crime.
Large numbers observed (32,800 in '08 and 55,400 in '10) provided sufficient samples; nearly 900 in all. And they were matched to voter files to see if they did actually vote.
It was shown more than 14% of non-citizens in both elections were registered to vote and many did vote.

Based on extrapolations from this survey, using the verified votes, they came up with 6.4% of non citizens voted in 2008 and 2.2% of non-citizens voted in 2010. Numberwise, that comes to 700,000. And that is using the very conservative estimate of 11 million here illegally. Of course, it is much, much higher than that.
Noted too was the fact many were asked for ID and showed obviously fraudulent ID's but were allowed to vote anyway. Others who could not produce any ID were allowed to vote a provisional ballot....a real joke.

Were you to read John Fund's wonderful and completely substantiated book on voter fraud, you would see the truth about voter fraud. Incidentally, the Russians didn't hack anyone to help Trump. Sorry! FAKE NEWS. Hillary lost because she stunk as a candidate and many they thought were going to vote for her never showed up at the polls.

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BBB 1 month ago

The Electoral College was instated in 1787 by white slaveholding men in order to placate slave owning states. (Remember this was a time when people bled fevers and witches were still persecuted). The rest of the world has progressed since the 1780’s. No other democracy uses an Electoral College - for a reason. This archaic system is profoundly undemocratic. This form of misguided American exceptionalism is imprudent and irrational. The founders were in fact not so wise in many issues from slavery to a government that has so many checks and balances that nothing is done, coalitions become impossible and third parties will not work. . I know it is a somewhat of irrational sacrosanct religion among some in the USA to say so, but elements of the constitution are empirically flawed. The Electoral College as FFP voting should have gone the way of muskets and tricorner hats

On the Right to Change a Constitution "We might as well require a man to wear still the coat which fitted him when a boy as civilized society to remain ever under the regimen of their barbarous ancestors." --Thomas Jefferson to Samuel Kercheval, 1816. ME 15:41

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Demimondaine 1 month ago

You can't really direct the label "Sore Losers" at Democrats now can you, not after Trump announced before the election, when it seemed he was running behind in all polls, that he wouldn't honor the results of the election. (Unless he won, he added -- which it seems he did with a little help from overseas). This utterly dishonorable, cowardly man threatened to became the first presidential candidate in this country's 240 year history to refuse to concede. He actually said that without shame, because he has no shame. And he has no conscience. The popular vote win for Hillary, meanwhile, is more of a moral victory -- a majority of citizens of this country did not chose a cowardly, dishonorable and dishonest man. They did not chose a traitor, a shallow power monger who wants to cuddle up to Russia and turn against our allies (and oh, for no good reason start a dangerous conflict with China, even before he's gotten into office). Also, I live in CA --your assessment of voting in CA is nonsense. Even most Republicans here would not agree their votes were "suppressed."

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Aleeta 1 month ago

More blatant lies from Linda Athens.

Obama did NOT "tell illegals it was safe for them to vote in the election". Despite out-of-context distortions by Athens and her ilk, what he actually said was that undocumented immigrants have "no voice" in the election, and can only be heard through relatives who have the legal right to vote:

www.snopes.com/california-motor-voter-act/

There is no legitimate evidence that illegals voted (especially on the scale she implies), and Athens didn't offer any.

As to "voter suppression" - Republican lawmakers in red states purged hundreds of thousands of minority voters from the voter rolls based on false information (with a complicated and lengthy process to be reinstated), and closed down the only places in minority areas where these Democratic-leaning voters could get the required I.D.

And of course there in no indication that Trump would have won more educated states like California simply by spending more time campaigning there.

Finally, it doesn't matter how many under-populated "counties" Trump won. Cows and prairie dogs don't vote, which outnumber human beings in some of those places. What matters are PEOPLE.

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Gunguy45 4 weeks, 1 day ago

Ahhh there it is again. Aleeta you and LGD must read from the same playbook. "More educated states...". In other words the rest of the states have a bunch of dummies? No, I think it more likely that the states with higher rankings have more brainwashed Liberals after 4-8 years of Liberal instruction by Liberal professors, that's all. Why is CA so far down on the list of HS grads but so high in college educations? Because it's a great place to go to school and party! Esp on your parents or the Governments dimes.

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Aleeta 4 weeks, 1 day ago

Gunguy45 - Red (Republican-leaning) states not only have a less educated populous than Blue states, but higher rates of divorce, drug addiction, and teen pregnancy (the last one is a no brainer though - between their worthless "abstinence only" education and closing down women's clinics where effective birth control could have been obtained, of course there are more teen pregnancies).

www.dailynews.com/opinion/20161128/red-stateblue-state-where-would-you-rather-live-thomas-elias

And what a ridiculous claim that people go to college in California to "party". However, it's probably true that very few university-level professors are bible-banging throw-backs who promote superstition over science.

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Gunguy45 4 weeks, 1 day ago

Really, the LA Times? Did you happen to actually look at the report? If you had you'd see the errors this writer made about drug overdoses. And conveniently didn't mention the higher rates for states like NM or WA (traditionally blue states) or NV or CO (mostly blue for the last 4 elections and got the rate for AZ wrong.
That pretty much puts the whole article in question now doesn't it? Of course what do you expect from a hardcore Liberal news source?

As to education, could it be because much of the tech and research jobs are in those states? You'll probably find in a few years that those numbers change as more jobs go to places like MN and UT. I don't really consider 4 percentage points as that big a deal anyway. That's the difference between CA and AZ. And as we all know (or should) having a degree does not magically impart intelligence. Most colleges do not open young minds, they fill them with garbage and seal them tight.

"Bible-banging throw-backs"...boy, you certainly are open about your hate for those who disagree with you.

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Wildrose 4 weeks, 1 day ago

When exactly was it that California became more educated? LOL! Too funny!

But you're right. What matters is people and Trump won enough people to trample Hillary in the electoral college.

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JohnHarden 1 month ago

"Again, had all been counted, Trump could have won the popular vote."

You don't know that, and neither does anyone else. But, we DO know that Hillary won the popular vote, whatever that means nowadays.

What DID happen though, was that one very unpopular candidate ran against a another untrustworthy , and won the electoral votes. That probably happened because of the unprecedented entry of the FBI. In the middle of a presidential campaign, it interjected itself not once, but twice...Unheard of!

But trump has stated before this election, "He lost the popular vote by a lot, (Obama) and won the election! We should have a revolution in this country!"

How prophetic! But how fitting!

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KingmanCares 1 month ago

Tomorrow, Monday, the Electoral College will confirm Trump as the winner even though the losers, stuck in the phase of bargaining after their loss, is imploring the Electors to break their promise, and in many (most?) states they don't even have a choice, they must vote the will of the people.

From the research I did the numbers of Counties that went for Trump was 2600 compared to the 420 for HRC. Regardless of which is correct; the country has spoken loud and clear to dump the liberal/obama/progressive agenda and get back to putting Americans first in America. Time to move forward. We gave Obama a chance in 08 when he was sadly elected and was quickly disappointed in the direction he clearly intended to take the country; then were shocked and horrified when he was re-elected in 2012. The bare minimum the losing side can do at this point is to accept the loss and give Trump and his vision a chance just like we did for Obama even if it’s short lived. Trust me; we know exactly how that feels.

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InformedIndependent 1 month ago

Let's quickly put another myth to bed here. People LOVE to say "we gave Obama a chance, you should quit being a sore loser and give Trump a chance". A quote from Mitch McConnell....we will do everything in our power to make sure Obama is a one term President. Yup, that is surely giving him a chance. I know I didn't vote for Obama, either time, but surely, I don't buy into some people's making up of their own facts.

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alkoffman 1 month ago

" and give Trump and his vision a chance just like we did for Obama " You mean like McConnell said while Obama was being sworn in. "the republicans will vote no to everything he comes up with". And held true to that for 8 years.

You are about fact free as Linda is.

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KingmanCares 4 weeks, 1 day ago

I guess I have to explain the most basic things these days. I was clearly, very clearly, talking about we as a people and not the congress in that post.

Now you bring up the Senate Speaker from out of left field. Is there some reason you aren't able to easily see I was speaking of the people, the voters, the electorate. I get the feeling my ankles are getting bitten by disgruntled far left uninformed chihuahua's.

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InformedIndependent 4 weeks, 1 day ago

Nice to have that little escape hatch to backtrack to your bubble when you get proven wrong. Throw out a couple of insults on your way though, so your Poutrage looks legitimate and there you have it.

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KingmanCares 1 month ago

Linda Athens, I think it's clear we are at an impasse with the leftists who post here, so the best thing might be to just let them think what they will regardless of how wrong it might be. High population states like California have 54 votes; Arizona has 11 and some states have as little as 3. I imagine they sometime think they don't have much say but they have as much say as the state of California where they have 18 times more votes because the Electoral College system allows everyone to be represented fairly and equally even if some refuse to accept that fact.

That's the real thing to remember. Our system worked well and to come along now and attempt to change the rules or way we elect our President is nothing more than sour grapes. There's nothing more to talk about. For us to continue to talk past each other accomplishes nothing. We had an election, even though there was no doubt a lot of voter fraud in some states, and yes, Obama did publicly okay voter fraud by illegals. Trump won. It’s past time to look forward and move on.

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InformedIndependent 4 weeks, 1 day ago

Translation.....we were wrong and they proved it, so let's hurl some insults and then say we are right, they are wrong and retreat to our bubbles to put our heads in the sand.

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KingmanCares 4 weeks, 1 day ago

Well Bob/Lynn It appears your translator is broken. Too bad Spock has passed on; I heard he was really good at fixing them. You definitely need help though because you again accuse me of insulting someone when anyone with even a modicum level of reading comprehension can see I didn't insult anyone. Pointing out incorrect information civilly and posting facts, without being politically correct, is hardly an insult to anyone who can think for themselves.

Again; our system worked in spite of voter irregularities because we had a clear winner using the system in place. I would like to see a full investigation to verify every CA and NYC voter, and then we would have a clearer view of how much the voting system in high illegal population states is corrupt (or isn’t). Maybe I'm wrong but without a full investigation we won't know. When or if we find voter fraud we will then know to expand that same investigation to all 50 states and pass voting laws such as voter ID to prevent it in the future. Do you also consider that an insult somehow?

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InformedIndependent 4 weeks ago

And there it is again. I am right and you are wrong, I will throw you some more insults, then retreat to my bubble to put my head in the sand and rely only on what Fox News tells me to think. You tried, you failed miserably, so, go on your way. For the record, who is BobLynn?

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KingmanCares 3 weeks, 6 days ago

Oh, Mr. Moore, you are so coy when you can remember what Linda Athens did decades ago but yet you can't remember your own name from one month ago. How very liberal of you sir. Oh; the irony!!!

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IndependentThinker 4 weeks ago

In 2008/12 we had a small minority of Repubs/conservatiives, egged on by the media for a news story, that harped on and on about Obama's birth certificate to no avail. If they really thought that was a problem, which I don't, they should have spent the last 8 years trying to pass a law that required whatever it was they wanted to be a prerequisite for running for president. Now we have a small minority of Dems/liberals, egged on by the media for a news story, complaining about the electoral college to no avail. The electoral college is the way it works today. If they really think it is a problem, which I don't, then they should spend their time trying to change the rules.
Whining and complaining will do no good. Trump will be POTUS in about a month. Lets all hope for the best for our country, to hell with our political parties.

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